System Logic Question

[Michael Carter]

I have a question about what sort of input/output card and software could accomplish this task:

I turn on window heat 10 minutes before taxiing on a 90 degree day. The overheat circuit trips the window heat off illuminating the amber indicators and extinguishing the green indicators.

I perform a reset of the window heat by cyling the four switches and each of the amber indicators extinguishes in turn. During the reset cycling, the green indicators do not illuminate, it only extinguishes the amber indicators esentially starting over again with all window heat off.

Could logic be programmed for a certain ambient temperature or an ambient temperature and a taxi speed (relative wind helping to cool the glass)?

"If the ambient air temperature is at or above XX degrees with window heat ON and taxi speed is at or below XX degrees, window heat will trip off."

"If window heat is tripped OFF, green indicators will extinguish and amber indicators will illuminate."

I'm very curious about what would be needed to accomplish this.

[AchillesP]

Hi,

Actually I have started to build this logic two days ago. It is very tricky logic but it can be done. The logic says that if it is a clear day (without clouds) and the TAT temperature is more that 30 celsious then the windows heat indicators will come on even if the switches are off after 3 minutes. In case you have the switches on then a window overheat will comes after 3 minutes with sixpack antiice and master caution indications. (In real the overheat is more than 145 F) If you close the switches then after 5 minutes the overheat goes off. And many other if's according to the book. Until now I have finished the logic but I have to disable the logic (that comes with pmsystems) of the test switch to work fine. I hope to find a solution very soon. I will make the logic public when it is fully working

Achilles

[Kennair]

Whew! You are really getting down to the nitty-gritty here Mike. I can only speak for OpenCockpits interfaces and certainly these along with it's program language SIOC could accommodate this. FS has various temperature offsets such as OAT=0E8C but there's also Lower Temp, Surface Temp, Temp drift, Temp day/night variation (don't know exactly what the differences are). It would be a matter of your switches connected to inputs and LED's connected to outputs, then SIOC would be scripted to provide LED on/off dependent on switch position and Temp value. Not sure about the Taxi speed cooling factor however, this may be getting a little picky :)

I don't know the exact parameters of the SIOC script file but if you did go down this road I'm sure Nico Kaan (Kiek) would help. As I mentioned in another thread, Opencockpit cards and SIOC can give you all the functionality of PMSystems if you learn what you're doing.

Ken.

[Michael Carter]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I mis-typed a word in my first post. It should be "XX knots" not "XX degrees"
when refering to a taxi speed.

Just curious about what I might be getting myself into with this level of functionality.

[kiek]

"If the ambient air temperature is at or above XX Knots with window heat ON and taxi speed is at or below XX Knots, window heat will trip off."

"If window heat is tripped OFF, green indicators will extinguish and amber indicators will illuminate."

Sure, you can program this in SIOC if ambient air temp and taxi speed can be made available to SIOC via FSUIPC offsets.


Nico

[Trevor Hale]

That could be programmed in PMsystems as well, for the same IF that Nico stated.

I am sure there is an offset for ambient air, and I know you could compare that to your airspeed.

And using a phidgets Output board or LED64

Trev

[kiek]

If you only want to control annunciators, and if you are able to program in SIOC, you only need the Opencockpits USB outputs board which is capable of controlling 64 leds (or lamps).

Costs are only EUR 56, SIOC is free.

Nico

[737NUT]

Just don't mix OC cards with phidgets!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here is my recommendation,
1) SIOC using the 64 output USB card. It will do your entire overhead and MIP!!!! It will do ANY of the logic you want as long as there are offsets for the data. So far i have not found anything that can't be done! NOTICE!!!!!!!!!! Fuse each group of 8 outputs with a 2 amp fuse. Don't ask me why i recommend this! :) Lets just say i learned the hard way.

or

2) Phidgets and PMSystems.

[dcutugno]

But i have problem with my OC USB OUTPUTS it introduce ground noises in my rig system...

[kiek]

advice: always use the same GND for all your systems in your sim ... this holds for every electronic system.

Nico

[dcutugno]

advice: always use the same GND for all your systems in your sim ... this holds for every electronic system.

Nico

Thanks Nico, i have tried everything and out of ideas...I tried common ground, ground to a shell or pc-case, different power supply and always the same story when i start to illuminate the first annunciator light my pc speakers make noises.

Can you show the diagram how connected and the jumpers on USB outputs card?

This is very strange 'cause i didn't have any problem with other interfaces.

[AchillesP]

Hello Simmers,

Actually I have finished the logic of window heat. Here it is.
Open the default pmsys737.lgc and find those lines below.

WindowHeatSLOn = (WindowHeatSL or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1
WindowHeatSROn = (WindowHeatSR or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1
WindowHeatFLOn = (WindowHeatFL or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus2
WindowHeatFROn = (WindowHeatFR or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus2

WindowOverHeatSL = (testheat = 0) [.2]
WindowOverHeatFL = (testheat = 0) [.2]
WindowOverHeatSR = (testheat = 0) [.2]
WindowOverHeatFR = (testheat = 0) [.2]

Make all those lines unable using // like below
//WindowOverHeatSL = (testheat = 0) [.2]

Insert my below logic
//WINDOW HEAT (Start)
WindowHeatSLC1 = WindowHeatSL [150]
WindowHeatFLC1 = WindowHeatFL [120]
WindowHeatFRC1 = WindowHeatFR [120]
WindowHeatSRC1 = WindowHeatSR [150]
WindowHeatSLOnC1 = ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 32) and (fsRainType = 0))
WindowHeatFLOnC1 = ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 30) and (fsRainType = 0))
WindowHeatFROnC1 = ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 30) and (fsRainType = 0))
WindowHeatSROnC1 = ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 32) and (fsRainType = 0))
WindowOverHeatSL = ((testheat = 0) [.2]) or ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 32) and (fsRainType = 0) and (WindowHeatSLC1))
WindowOverHeatFL = ((testheat = 0) [.2]) or ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 30) and (fsRainType = 0) and (WindowHeatFLC1))
WindowOverHeatFR = ((testheat = 0) [.2]) or ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 30) and (fsRainType = 0) and (WindowHeatFRC1))
WindowOverHeatSR = ((testheat = 0) [.2]) or ((DayTime = 1) and (fsTAT > 32) and (fsRainType = 0) and (WindowHeatSRC1))
WindowHeatSLOn = ((WindowHeatSL or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1) or (WindowHeatSLOnC1))
WindowHeatFLOn = ((WindowHeatFL or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1) or (WindowHeatFLOnC1))
WindowHeatFROn = ((WindowHeatFR or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1) or (WindowHeatFROnC1))
WindowHeatSROn = ((WindowHeatSR or (Testheat = 2)) and transbus1) or (WindowHeatSROnC1))
//WINDOW HEAT (End)

Find the line sixpackantiice = (fspitot = 0) or (testheat=0) and make it as below
sixpackantiice = (fspitot = 0) or (testheat=0) or WindowOverHeatSL or WindowOverHeatFL or WindowOverHeatFR or WindowOverHeatSR

And a short description what this does.
If it is summer and it is day and there is no rain and the tat is more than 30 Celcius, the on indicators comes on. If you open the switch an overheat will come after 2..3 minutes.. The overheat goes off after 2..3 minutes if you close the switch or if the tat is below 30 celcius (Means taxi with hi speed or in the air)

Hope you enjoy that.

Achilles

[737NUT]

advice: always use the same GND for all your systems in your sim ... this holds for every electronic system.

Nico


Does no good my friend. PWM is VERY noisey and when you share gnd's with it it only gets worse. I have fought it for 3 weeks! I know first hand. They are using cheap electronics and designs BUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

It is still worth the money!

[737NUT]

Thanks Nico, i have tried everything and out of ideas...I tried common ground, ground to a shell or pc-case, different power supply and always the same story when i start to illuminate the first annunciator light my pc speakers make noises.

Can you show the diagram how connected and the jumpers on USB outputs card?

This is very strange 'cause i didn't have any problem with other interfaces.

See my post above, the USB 64 card is a poor design (noise wise) but good for it's price. You must keep that in mind, you get what you pay for.

[Michael Carter]

Not generally a great idea, but my experience with studio recording equipment and 60Hz hum had me lifting every ground on every piece of gear until I found the culpret.

It happened to be a DBX 166 comp/limiter that was giving me the trouble. I would systematically start lifting grounds on your equipment until you find the offender.

Keep the fluorescent lighting away from circuits as well if you are using any under your glareshields on the older Boeings as I am.

[kiek]

Does no good my friend. PWM is VERY noisey and when you share gnd's with it it only gets worse. I have fought it for 3 weeks! I know first hand. They are using cheap electronics and designs BUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

It is still worth the money!

Well, I can tell you that I have no problems at all with OC cards (over 5 years). All my cards are connected to the power supply of my flightsim PC and hence share the same ground. I'm not using external power supplies.

Nico

[kiek]

Thanks Nico, i have tried everything and out of ideas...I tried common ground, ground to a shell or pc-case, different power supply and always the same story when i start to illuminate the first annunciator light my pc speakers make noises.

Can you show the diagram how connected and the jumpers on USB outputs card?


+5V and GND from the power supply of my flight sim PC goes to the connector bottom right (NOT the external option one).
JMP 1 = open
JMP 2 = closed (both pins connected by the jumper)

Nico