Building a Cockpit without knowledge

[Flyer09]

Good evening gentelman,

i'm new here and want to say: "Hello".

I want to build a Homecockpit. Yes. But I'm not only here to get information about this else I would like to amend my English knowledge by reading and writing into the Forum. As patient please. :)

So, let's beginn with the central topic. My quesitions are:

1. What is easier to realise for example, Airbus or Boeing? As which component is easy to find and build?

2. My target is to be seated like a Pilot. I would like to when I seat into my "Cockpit" the feeling like a Pilot. I would like to have that all has their place.

3. For example: What I need to build a Radio Stack of Airbus oder Boeing 738 (the new style of the Radio's)

4. Important it's for me, that the costs are so low like possible.

Okay, I hope you unterstand my newbie English (a little) and can answer me.

regards

[autocadplease]

Flyer09,

What I did years ago was look at what others had done and see what I liked. I would suggest you browse the photo gallery and see what interests you: http://www.mycockpit.org/photopost/index.php The photos also give you an idea of how things go together. Remember you can build almost everything yourself or buy commercially made products. There is also lots of info in the file library http://www.mycockpit.org/fileshare/index.php.

Welcome!

[Flyer09]

Thanks for answer.

Me interests...hmm...I don't know. What would be cheaper, to build a Airbus or Boeing? Which components could I better easier build? For which aircraft can I get good and cheap or freeware Software? This are quesions about my decision how aircraft I would like to build. Important is for me that the price is not to much.

I would like realise for example that:

I would like to have a Seat than forward of me, should be a Panel with ND, PFD UDU etc. At my left side should be a board to attach charts. At the right side I Radio Stack, and here maybe should be a Transponder, ADF, COM1 and COM2, NAV 1 and NAV2. A FMC etc. I overhead Panel is at first not so important that can I see via a external Display. And a MCP would be good, too :D

But I can't find any Tutorials how I can build this components. And what do you think, would be cost that?

regrads

[autocadplease]

Here are some good sites with detailed tutorials on the 737:

http://users.skynet.be/jcordon/cockpit/dossiers.htm
http://www.737ng.co.uk/technical.htm

Which is cheaper? I don't think one is cheaper than the other if you build most things yourself because the components and the processes are the basically the same. However, there seems to be a lot more 737NG & A320 commercial products available to buy than other aircraft types.

If you plan on building your own electronics then you will need some type of interface to allow for inputs and possibly outputs to communicate with your hardware and flight sim. FSUIPC is a must for this http://www.schiratti.com/dowson.html

There is some freeware, like freeFD http://www.mycockpit.org/fileshare/showentry.php?e=144&catid=searchresults&searchid=286 and Alpha FMC http://members.quicknet.nl/scumari/fmc/

Total cost? I build/add items as I can afford them. Sometimes it takes me a while to save up for things. If you want to buy everything at once - that could be a large amount. How much, that depends on a lot of things.

One thing to keep in mind is that most systems use a network of computers to run their simulator. The networked computers do not need to be high end computers.

It is hard to explain everything in one post. Best to ask a few questions at a time, then members can be more detailed in their answers.

[Ronson2k9]

I would look at from what you want to do with the your simpit more then a brand name let's say. The type of flying you want or the route you like or airline you like. Cost is all relative and between the two Boeing or Airbus I should think pretty similar as they share many of the same components.

Starting with the airport you like the most then the route or destinations you like the most. Find the airlines that fly that route and the fleet information and and perhaps even the scheduling? As not all planes are going on all routes. Then when you have the airport/airline - fleet/route. Then pick a aircraft that fits.

From a flight sim standpoint it's not the being there it's the getting there that's the fun part. So if you think of your cockpit as a getting there delivery device then your halfway home.

Most major airlines have a mix of both 'brands' of aircraft. So it wouldn't be so difficult to hit the barn door on that one. What you perhaps need though is to find the 'size' of plane your flying over the route you like most. There are subtle differences between a 737, 747 and 767. Depending on how detailed your sim is going to be you may want to take the type into consideration. I think on the Airbus those differences between types are much less. So with Airbus there is a greater variety and less specialization. Airbus people may correct me on that though?

So some questions you need to ask yourself..

1 - What aircraft do you like to fly the most in the sim right now?
2 - What airport/city do you like to fly out of and or into the most right now?
3 - What airlines (Liveries) do you like the most?

Once you have answered those then..

4a- (Favorite Geography) What airlines use your Departure and or arrival airport you like the most?
4b - (Favorite Aircraft) What airlines use your favorite aircraft? or
4c - (Favorite Airline) What aircraft do your favorite airline use?

That should give you your favorite airline/aircraft and airport

Models worthy of having a simpit built around them.
6 - Are there good models (flight models) of the aircraft that are in the sim already?

There are a few different ways to look at a simulator. For me it's the way an airline works and where they do there business that is important. You are going to want a aircraft and route that your happiest to fly and with an airline you like for many different reasons. Then you can decide what plane stirs your passion for flying the most.

Go with the one that you love as it's a journey you don't want to tire of once you start down that path to a full size sim. Cost is pretty relative and not to dependent on brand. Your time will reduce the cost. So the more work you are willing to do the cheaper it will be. As they say time is money you can trade one for the other in most instances.

Build the one you love the most. It's a long term relationship so find the one that you will still want to fly in the end and build that one.

Best wishes
Ron

[BHawthorne]

1. What is easier to realise for example, Airbus or Boeing? As which component is easy to find and build?

4. Important it's for me, that the costs are so low like possible.


1. None are easy builds. All require hundreds of hours to complete. As long as you go into the build realizing that, you should be ok. This isn't a weekend project. Also, realize that if you do not enjoy building things, you'll sour to this hobby fast. Simpits are as much about flying as building -- in some cases more building than flying.

4. Realize that this will ultimately cost several thousands of dollars to do. Also realize that you can spread the build time and cost over several years to soften the blow on your pocketbook. You can't just go down to Walmart and drop $5k and be flying this weekend.

I'm not saying any of this to discourage you. I just want you to realize the scope of such a hobby. This hobby involves a lot of highly technical skills to achieve and the learning curve can be quite steep. That's why places like this forum exist though.

[capetonian]

Hi FLyer09.

I think the guys have kinda summed up the essentials. I'd like to his on your point about finding tutorials and the like.

I am really on a budget but I love simming and my 14year old is crazy about flying so we have decided on a 737 cockpit. Like most people here we too are on a budget and I think our budget might be a little tighter then general. Because of this I decided to build the panel from MDF, once I had started I realized that although I have basic woodworking skills, MDF and I were not going to be friends when it came to making little square holes for annunciators and the like. I went ahead and ordered a Main instrument Panel from Poldragonet/ Symulatory and I am quite satisfied with what I got. Now we are building the MIP stand and I have started putting the electronics cards together for all the switches and lights, we have just embarked on a journey that I know will be a long and winding one but it's going to be a load of fun to travel!!

For instrument panels and cockpit modules there are a load of tutorials on the web:
http://www.sim-737ng.com/
http://www.737ngproject.be/
http://users.skynet.be/jcordon/cockpit/index.htm
http://www.boeing737sim.se/SimBuildPics/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/raflyer/MIP.html?1193278549750


Interfacing cards:
http://www.opencockpits.com/

Misc tutorials:
http://personales.ya.com/micabina737/indexi.htm

And really google is your friend, there is a load of information to be found. I think you might be german or german speaking, I am sure tere are a lot of people in Germany building cockpits. Ask around, look for forums (like this one, well done :) ) and maybe you can get in touch with cockpit builders near you (I consider 1-1,5 hours near enough :) ). Maybe you can visit their sim and try it out or get suggestions and see how they have approached it.

Although I have not met up with anyone form the forum yet I was immediately welcomed by the rest and some people in Holland said I was welcome to visit their sim.

Don;t worry about your English, ... it's my first language and I have been living in a non English country for so long that I often make mistakes :)

[gokhotit]

Why build a Big Boeing or an Arrogant Airbus?? Why not build your own design? A lot of times it is cheaper, you can get whatever you want, and the fun never ends.

[kiek]

i'm new here and want to say: "Hello".

Hello,

Building a cockpit without knowledge is not possible, I'm afraid...
You can buy one without knowledge, but building one ....no. It requires lots of skills (mechanical, electrical, computer, ..) and lots of hours.

I recommend to start reading forums, so you will get a better understanding of what is needed.

Just asking a question here, will not work. Ofcourse people will respond, but they can only talk about their own experiences. It's hard for them to compare one solution with another and posts will always be affected by people being a 'fan' of Boeing or a 'fan' of Airbus, same with interface methods, and so on.

It's like you would ask "What is the best soccer team in Germany, or in Spain?" ;-)

[Flyer09]

No, I know which typ I would like to build, but the pivotal question is, which is cheaper. When Airbus are cheaper build I a Airbus or the other way around. Also, with which Aircraft would I get better informations? This is important. But I want to say: I want don't to build a FULL Cockpit. When I build for example a Boeing 738 - want I build a MIP (left Side, only)

Would be this realism? When I build a MIP with a MDF and behind this comes a 22" (?)Display for ND, PFD and UDU. And later (when I'm able to build it) a Gear Lever. And then I can buy a Yoke System for 200 Euros. And then I need just a MCP and a FMC. But this is a little to diffucult hence can I to announce this "Instruments" via a other external display. The frist should be, to feel like a Pilot at the seat not more. I believe when I can see the Instument behind of the MDF board, would be the feeling great.

regards

[Ronson2k9]

If you have a model in mind then you can go till you run into a snag then ask someone here for some assistance. There is a great amount of information here on both brands of aircraft in the File Library area.

http://www.mycockpit.org/fileshare/index.php

As far as differences go between them they aren't all that different from each other. They both have very similar components (as all planes share) but beyond that they have similar cockpit layouts and instruments. As you can tell by doing a bit of research on them.

This is a great resource of info as well as pictures of the actual flight decks.
http://www.airliners.net/

The only way to know what the differences are in pricing for building one or the other is if someone built one then quit to build the other or if someone built both. As it's much like a custom car. There are hundreds of ways to customize your car but only you would know how much your way cost. You wouldn't price out both brands to see which is cheaper to build. It's a personal preference.

Another option if you can't decide for sure which you like more Boeing or Airbus then you could go 'Down the middle' and build a custom cockpit incorporating the bits you like from each. Then fly the one in the sim on that day that you want to fly. Many have built a custom creation not following exactly the blueprint of the aircraft. Many times there is a bit of guess work in building anyway. So you can be flying a A330 one day and the next in your B737 the next. It's what ever makes you happy that's important.

In the end the Simpit is an extension of the Flight Simulator into the 'Real' world that is somewhat missing in the keyboard/mouse controls that you would normally use to control the Flight Sim at your desk. So you can go as far into the actual flight deck or far away from it as you would like. It's all up to you.

I would pick the plane you like the most from the Flight Simulator then work form there. Just like buying a new car look online to find all you can about that plane.

- What the flight deck looks like? (airliners.net)
- What the avionics package includes. (Manufacturers Website/mycockpit.org - File Library - Aircraft Manuals)
- What airlines use that plane? (airliners.net)
- What models/liveries are available in FS (Flightsim.com)
- Check the forums here for other builders and read/ask about there experiences.

As it's been mentioned before start out with a plan then ad a little at a time as money/time is available. There are articles on how to build nearly everything the modern flight deck includes.

So in your plan make a note of what you need to start off with. Most times..

1 - Shell or platform of some kind (Seat, MIP)
2 - Flight controls (Yoke, Rudder)
3 - Two monitors (One for instruments and one for Visuals)

Then add on.

4 - Pedestal (Throttle Quadrant)
5 - Autopilot
6 - Analog Gauges
7 - Overhead (Systems controls)

Everyone starts somewhere so we all started with no knowledge at all and worked our way to a fairly knowledgeable bunch. So no need to by shy.. :)

Seems like your starting down the right track already... I wish you success in your cockpit building adventure.

[BHawthorne]

Seriously, don't build based on which is cheaper. Look around and figure out which layout you like best. You're going to pour a ton of time into whatever you do, you better like what it is. Try out the various add-on aircraft. See which ones you have most fun flying. Then read up on other people's experiences interfacing those add-ons. While there are a lot of people doing Boeing and Airbus, that doesn't always mean they're the best fit for your build. Do what you would enjoy, not what you believe might be easier, because ultimately none of it is easy.

The shells are built for around the same price. Where the costs can go crazy are on the details like DZUS fasteners, interface boards and switch count. I suppose if you want to cut costs a bit shoot for cockpit layout that is mostly glass cockpit and few interface switches.

[Flyer09]

Ok Thank you much for all answers. But I think, I will wait with my project. Maybe build I little thinks like a Radio to select the Freq. from ATC. Also not difficult thinks. And everyday can I still build a "real" Cockpit.


Tanks again :)

regards