Milling Machine or CNC?

[Crescent]

Hi there. I'm in a debate as to buying a milling machine or a cnc router. I'm familiar with milling machines, but not at with cnc. So, what's the difference or drawbacks? I know lot's on here use one or the other, so post your experiences please.

Thanks.

[Hessel Oosten]

Hi Crescent,

Milling machine: You know it. Power, no subtile shapes.

CNC: Much less power, difficult shapes.

In fact that's the real difference, the rest is secondary.

Hessel

[Joe Cygan]

A CNC Mill has rigidity and is an extremely solid tool. A CNC mill will cut and shape hard/soft metals or any material to very accurate dimensions.

A CNC router usually uses a gantry and is not as solid as a CNC mill as it does not need to be. You would never cut a steel piston head with a CNC router but you would with a CNC Mill. CNC routers generally favor soft metals, plastic and wood and the work tables can be very large in dimension (very cost affective).

[Westozy]

Hi Crescent,
I know exactly what you are thinking as I am a fitter/machinist by trade with quite a bit of milling experience and was faced with the same decision a while back. I have been looking for a cnc machine for quite a while and was lucky enough to score this one off Ebay last week. I decided on buying a cnc router as most of the parts I make are PVC. From all accounts it isn't that hard to get your head around and many say that it becomes a hobby in itself. My machine has been made by a pro from billet aluminium and it is solid as a rock so I was thrilled to pick it up for just AUD$875.
CNC....go for it!!!
http://www.mycockpit.org/photopost/data/575/CNC_Router_1.jpg


Regards, Gwyn

[BHawthorne]

Hi there. I'm in a debate as to buying a milling machine or a cnc router. I'm familiar with milling machines, but not at with cnc. So, what's the difference or drawbacks? I know lot's on here use one or the other, so post your experiences please.

Thanks.


Both can be made to CNC.

3 axis mill can do metals while the router is limited mostly to wood and plexi although some soft Al could be done on the router I guess with slow IPM. You do your small intricate parts on the 3 axis CNC and can do larger shells cutting MDF on a large router CNC. When I think router table I think at least 4x4 foot size...perferably an ideal 5x10 foot table. There are people who do a lot smaller router tables, but if you go small just CNC a 3 axis mill. Better accuracy and can cut more. Small router tables are not really the way to go if you want to cut diverse materials. A lot of people here probably use them though as the plans are readily avaialble. I suggest just scaling the plans to 4x4 foot or more and doing that as a router table. As far as 3 axis mill just CNC retrofit an X2 or X3 Chinese mill and replace out the crap parts on it also with retrofit kits that are readily avaialble.

[Crescent]

Thanks guys for all the info. That pretty much answers my question...I need both! :)

[Joe Cygan]

Thanks guys for all the info. That pretty much answers my question...I need both! :)

There you go!

[BHawthorne]

Thanks guys for all the info. That pretty much answers my question...I need both! :)

Don't really need either, but you can do a ton of cool things (plus earn a bit of $$$ on the side with them) owning both. Of all the hobbies out there, CNC might be the only one I know that might pay for itself (if you're lucky). CNC in and of itself is a time consuming hobby, so keep in mind you'd now have 2 very time consuming hobbies. ;)

[Steve A]

Are we talking hobby cnc's and millers here because in real life a manual miller can do everything a cnc can do just slower, given the the right equipment on the bed like rotary tables, boring heads, keyway cutters and sine bars etc etc.

Personally i love cnc's but really given the choice i would have a good quality manual miller with auto feed in xyz and maybe a digital readout there wouldn't be a peice of material it couldn't machine.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1990-BRIDGEPORT-9-x-48-SERIES-I-VERT-MILLING-MACHINE_W0QQitemZ360205254173QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Mills?hash=item53dde7fe1d

[BHawthorne]

Are we talking hobby cnc's and millers here because in real life a manual miller can do everything a cnc can do just slower, given the the right equipment on the bed like rotary tables, boring heads, keyway cutters and sine bars etc etc.

Personally i love cnc's but really given the choice i would have a good quality manual miller with auto feed in xyz and maybe a digital readout there wouldn't be a peice of material it couldn't machine.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1990-BRIDGEPORT-9-x-48-SERIES-I-VERT-MILLING-MACHINE_W0QQitemZ360205254173QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Mills?hash=item53dde7fe1d

CNC retrofitting a Bridgeport would be my ideal 3 axis setup. I'd rather spend my time working out toolpaths in a CAM app than burning the time doing it manually. But really, it's just a personal preference. Most things can be machined perfectly fine manually though. My reasoning behind CNC vs manual is that I'd like to simulate the toolpaths before cutting, that way I'm not messing up an expensive piece of stock. Then again I'd probably use cheap MDF to prototype with before cutting actual metal stock.

[Steve A]

And not forgetting of course it takes years of training to be a competent manual miller and that helps a lot if you move onto a cnc ;)

[BHawthorne]

And not forgetting of course it takes years of training to be a competent manual miller and that helps a lot if you move onto a cnc ;)

I've always equated out a competant machnist to be one who has all his fingers and eyes still in working order. Some machinists who are competant manual millers can't say that much. You're only as good as your worst mistake. Although mills are a hobby, they're definitely not toys. :wink:

[flatlandpilot]

I bought a sable2015 not long ago,
and can do 20 x 18 cm.
a little small butt, I'm very happy with it,
for "panels" a "resolution" of .1 mm. is more than good enough
I think to go for "router" size and speed is more wise than "milling" accuracy.

[BHawthorne]

I think to go for "router" size and speed is more wise than "milling" accuracy.

Really depends on your target goals. Speed isn't going to be an issue with one-off parts made for personal projects. Personally, I find accuracy more important than speed on the parts I do.

[Crescent]

Where would you guys recommend buying a milling machine from? I've been looking at tons of them...and no, I'm not looking at something in the 14k range hehe. I figure a manual one, with autofeed etc.

A couple of sites that caught my eye were Harbor Freight and Grizzly Tools. I am in Canada, but it's probably going to be cheaper to buy out of the states.

[autocadplease]

General / Gorilla now makes some http://www.gorillacnc.com/cnc_machines

Any General dealer in Canada (www.general.ca) can get them. The Tool Place in Kelowna should be able to get them.

I built my own from http://www.rockcliffmachine.com/ and am building a bigger and better one http://www.joescnc.com/themachines-hybrid.php.

Either way you won't regret getting one!

[BHawthorne]

Where would you guys recommend buying a milling machine from? I've been looking at tons of them...and no, I'm not looking at something in the 14k range hehe. I figure a manual one, with autofeed etc.

A couple of sites that caught my eye were Harbor Freight and Grizzly Tools. I am in Canada, but it's probably going to be cheaper to buy out of the states.

Harbor Freight or Grizzly both sell the X2. It's hard to get a context to the size for the X2, but it's pretty small. You'd do most of your detail work with it. If you do go with something like an X2 or Sherline minimill I really suggest using www.littlemachineshop.com for consumables. They cater to the minimill and minilathe hobbiests.

As far as routers both Rockcliff and MechMate come to mind for plans. It's the first time I've seen the Joes CNC link before, but it looks like a very good design for a 48x48" table.

Of the minimill and the router you can go cheap or expensive as needed. You are essentially trading off accuracy for $$$ though. Even the cheap ones make great parts, it's just that you won't be doing professional quality/quantity work with it with high tolerance specs.