Tecnam P2006t simulator

[B738pilot]

Hello, I am proud to write my second post on this forum :D

Me and my friend are planning to build a Tecnam P2006t simulator and we would like to certify it for training purposes. Unfortunately JAR STD requirements are very strict and we're not sure if we manage to fulfill them...

The first thing I would like to ask is whether anyone has some experience in Tecnam P2006t sim?? The biggest problem it that I can't even find the FS2004 model of this aircraft...
One of the requirements is that "Control forces and control travels which respond in the same
manner under the same flight conditions as in the aeroplane or class
of aeroplane being simulated." Unfortunately we have no idea how to construct steering in such a way that the plane reacts quicker for yoke movements with higher speed and also that the forces on the yoke are stronger at higher speeds...
The second thing: "Aerodynamic modelling shall reflect:
(a) the effects of airframe icing;" - is it possible to model in the sim??

Would really appreciate any help :D
Cheers!

[Ronson2k9]

First welcome to mycockpit.org and second that it's a really nice looking plane. You do have a pretty big problem with not having an FSX or FS2004 model of the aircraft. You will need to create or find someone to create one for you. It's quite similar to the rockwell commander/shrike.

http://flightsim.com/file.php?cm=SEARCH1&fsec=0&fname=AC500CA1.ZIP

You may want to consider a change to a model that is currently available? There are other high wing twins that it would be close to. The rockwell is a bit long in the tooth but still there are 79 of them still flying in the USA. There is a Tecnam P2006t for X-Plane though.

http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?showtopic=18342

The Mitsubishi MU-2 is also quite close to the Tecnam PT2006t

http://flightsim.com/file.php

Yoke movements are pretty standard for the most part in GA aircraft. The heavies have a bit of lag. It's much like the effect of steering an ocean liner as opposed to a speed boat.

Duplicating the panel isn't to hard depending on weather you want the analog or the glass version? The airplane is quite new so a model could be forthcoming but I would secure that knowledge first before embarking on one unless you are willing to build one yourself? If not I would perhaps go with one that is already available. It may not be exactly what you want but then it will work pretty well right out of the box..

Best of luck on your build and be sure to keep us updated.
Ron

[B738pilot]

Actually, we were going to use FS2004 or FSX as a simulator engine, but if we have no choice we will use the X-plane. Additionally, I found the Garmin 1000 software in the avsim library, which we want to use in our plane, which is running on FSX. I'm afraid that neither of us is able to write the model, so maybe we will try, as you suggested, changing some that already exists.

From the start we intended to model the glass cockpit with G1000, however later we came to an idea that it would be really more fun having both glass and analog panel in one simulator. We would use LCD monitors and install software for both, Garmin 1000 and analog instruments. Then we could choose what is displayed on the monitors - either G1000 or analog instruments.
Unfortunately we don't know how to do it and even if it is possible...

As soon as our work gets some visible effects I'll post some pics and keep you updated :)

[dnoize]

Unfortunately JAR STD requirements are very strict and we're not sure if we manage to fulfill them...

and


One of the requirements is that "Control forces and control travels which respond in the same
manner under the same flight conditions as in the aeroplane or class
of aeroplane being simulated."!

and


The second thing: "Aerodynamic modelling shall reflect:
(a) the effects of airframe icing;" - is it possible to model in the sim??


The above combination and a number of other obstacles will make it impossibe to make FS9 or FSX the basis of a JAR STD approoved simulator.


Stef

[B738pilot]

I heard that guys from Project Magenta built a 737NG sim, which was JAR certified. However, I don't know what engine they used for it...

[DarrenBe]

JAR FSTD(A) standards are achievable with a device running FS9 or FSX, but the chance of success depends on the data you have access to on the aircraft you intend to simulate. The other factor is the 'Level' of standard you are trying to achieve.
I've recently had some involvement in the acceptance testing of a Level 3 FTD (Heavy twin-engined helicopter) and there is nothing magical about getting a device qualified - literally any flight simulation software could be used, as long as the device meets the regulations. Even the larger manufacturers have to 'fudge' their flight models sometimes to meet the requirements, despite having data from actual flight trials.
If your serious about qualification I suggest you try and get your hands on 'Principles of Flight Simulation' by D J Allerton. Its a bit on the pricey side, but does give you a good insight into the world of Flight Simulation, as well as access to some useful source code.

[B738pilot]

JAR FSTD(A) standards are achievable with a device running FS9 or FSX, but the chance of success depends on the data you have access to on the aircraft you intend to simulate. The other factor is the 'Level' of standard you are trying to achieve.
I've recently had some involvement in the acceptance testing of a Level 3 FTD (Heavy twin-engined helicopter) and there is nothing magical about getting a device qualified - literally any flight simulation software could be used, as long as the device meets the regulations. Even the larger manufacturers have to 'fudge' their flight models sometimes to meet the requirements, despite having data from actual flight trials.
If your serious about qualification I suggest you try and get your hands on 'Principles of Flight Simulation' by D J Allerton. Its a bit on the pricey side, but does give you a good insight into the world of Flight Simulation, as well as access to some useful source code.

We want to certify the sim for FNTP type II (without MCC). I am the member of the flight school, which possesses Tecnam P2006t so I have an easy access to a flight manual and I can fly this plane. Maybe I could even get some interesting docs from the manufacturer with some help of the flight school :D
Thanks very much for the info about the 'Principles of Flight Simulation', I never realised something like this exists, I'm sure it will be very helpful :D

Unfortunately I am not sure whether cerification of such a simulator is easy in my country... Our Civil Aviation Office loves finding faults with everything...