To buy the FDS MCP/EFIS and CDU or not

[birdyguy]

Hello everyone,


I'm looking into buying an MCP/EFIS and CDU from Flight Deck Solutions as they are near me and their products look quite good. Currently I am using the PMDG737NGX as my flight model and I'm wondering if any of you have used this gear with the PMDG NGX and what your experiences with them were. Looking forward to hearing comments on this.

Thanks

Ed

[OmniAtlas]

How about cp flight MCP? I believe the FDS version is missing a solenoid angle, bank angle and perhaps a few more functions. I might be confused with the opencockpit version.

[birdyguy]

Ahh, this is exactly the kind of information I'm looking for. I will have to do some research on this area. Thanks. I lean to FSD as they are close by, but at the same time, i prefer full functionality.

Ed

[fordgt40]

How about cp flight MCP? I believe the FDS version is missing a solenoid angle, bank angle and perhaps a few more functions. I might be confused with the opencockpit version.

Both FDS and CPFlight MCPs have different specs according to the model ie pro or "entry"

[birdyguy]

Both FDS and CPFlight MCPs have different specs according to the model ie pro or "entry"

Hi fordgt40,

I received a very informative email from Claudio at CP Flight describing the differences between the Pro and the EL MCP/EFIS. If the budget can handle it, the Pro would be the way to go. Dont know if there is anything better out there at this time.

At FDS only I see the Jetmax MCP/EFIS which lacks some of the functions available on the CP Pro/EL models.

[birdyguy]

Both FDS and CPFlight MCPs have different specs according to the model ie pro or "entry"


You're right. With a bit of digging I found the FDS Pro version of the MCP/EFIS. It's very expensive though. $4011.50 Canadian after taxes but not including shipping versus $1700 plus shipping for the CP Flight Pro MCP/EFIS. (Not sure how much shipping would be) Looks like CF flight more fits into my budget.

all the best,

Ed

[fordgt40]

Glad you found it! I was about to post the link.
Yes it is expensive, but I was just suggesting a comparison "on a like for like basis" :p

David

[OmniAtlas]

How did you come up with that price for the Cp flight MCP? It's 999 euro excluding VAT.

Sismo has also just released a full functioning MCP for 800 euro.

[OmniAtlas]

Edit - you must have included the EFIS with that.

[birdyguy]

Hi OmniAtlas,

Yes I included the EFIS in both quotes. It also includes the exchange rate of Euro to Canadian dollars. Approximately 1300 Euro to Canadian gives around 1700.00 Canadian. I'm pretty sure I will go with the EL series, as much as I would love the pro, it's a wee bit steep for my budget.

All the best,

Ed

Sismo, will take a look at them as well. Thanks.

[saabpilot]

Hello everyone,


I'm looking into buying an MCP/EFIS and CDU from Flight Deck Solutions

Ed

With the CP Flight EL series (MCP and EFIS) and the FDS CDU you cannot go wrong.
FDS and CP Flight has the very best reputation and outstanding after sales service.

Best,
Bjorn

Stockholm, Sweden
Boeing 737NG Simulator Project (http://www.boeing737sim.se)

[birdyguy]

Hi Bjorn,

Thanks for your comments. I think in the end that will be how I go. The El series from CP and the CDU from FDS. Awesome job of your 737 sim.

All the best

[birdyguy]

Hi all,

Ordered the 737 MCP EL and EFIS EL from CP Flight today. I'm really leaning towards the OC FMC V3 . It looks good and the price fits my budget.

Ed

[birdyguy]

CP Flight MCP and EFIS arrived at my door today. 6 days from the time I ordered it. I'm very impressed with this company. I ordered my CDU from FDS on the 9th. Should be in early next week. They look beautiful. Haven't had a chance to use them yet as I had to make feet for them as I dont have an MIP yet. Will keep you posted.

until next time,

Ed

[OmniAtlas]

I am also thinking of going this route but wondering if it will all fit together.

Cp flight MCP and EFIS with flyengravity MIP
FDS CDU with FDS cdu bay.

[birdyguy]

I am also thinking of going this route but wondering if it will all fit together.

Cp flight MCP and EFIS with flyengravity MIP
FDS CDU with FDS cdu bay.

My guess is that it would all fit together as Fly Engravity and CP Flight are tied closely together. I believe that CP Flight provides equipment for Fly Engravity or visa versa but I would say the two will work well together. Claudio of CP flight seems a super nice guy to deal with. If you email him, you wont have to wait long for a reply, providing it's during his waking hours. I bugged the heck out of him before I made my decision to buy, and he never once showed annoyance with me. Always informative polite answers.

I'd ask him just to be sure though. I love the looks of the gear. I've played with the buttons, like the feel of them as well. Seems to be quite sturdy. Wish I had the money for the pro version, but I think this will do me nicely. The shipping was amazing. Scheduled to arrive late in the day Monday, it arrived today..blew me away when I answered the door (big grin) Christmas again :-) As expensive as they are, I do believe I will be looking at the CP Flight Radios as well. The service makes it all worth while. No stress. I'll post again when I get it set up and running. Still need to make a little foot for the EFIS to sit on.

Any more questions..shoot them along.
all the best,

[OmniAtlas]

Yes the cpflight components will fit well with the flyengravity but what about the fds cdu bay and the flyengravity mip? My issue with the flyengravity mip is that there is no subpanel or stand included.

Have you looked at the cp flight ICS? Everything is plug and play requiring no wiring! If you add up the cost of the masterboard, electrical components and power supply, it more or less equals the cost of the ICS.

[birdyguy]

Sorry, misread your question. FDS makes a bracket for the CP Flight MCP and EFIS so I know that these will fit. Is part of the reason I chose to go CP Flight as I didn't care for the FDS MCP.

It's really hard to say though about the FDS cdu bay fitting the Fly Engravity MIP , I think both structures will be built to specs but being two different companies they may fit or attach things differently. I'm guessing it wouldn't fit so well.

Myself I am probably going to go the JetMax737K route minus the gear I already have. Everything all ready to fly.

All the best

[OmniAtlas]

Hi Ed,

Be careful with fitting the CP Flight EFIS to the Jetmax/FDS MIP, there are some stories (and I have some photos) of the EFIS being not to scale -- now that might be the older version, I am not too sure, but I would check with Peter (FDS).

I decided not to go the Jetmax route (although I have a jetmax throttle on order) because I wanted the option to expand to a full MIP later if need be. The Jetmax does not have backlighting like the full MIP or like the flyengravity panels.

It seems the FDS CDU bay may be able to just slide under the Flyengravity MIP if all is to scale.

[birdyguy]

Hi Ed,

Be careful with fitting the CP Flight EFIS to the Jetmax/FDS MIP, there are some stories (and I have some photos) of the EFIS being not to scale -- now that might be the older version, I am not too sure, but I would check with Peter (FDS).

I decided not to go the Jetmax route (although I have a jetmax throttle on order) because I wanted the option to expand to a full MIP later if need be. The Jetmax does not have backlighting like the full MIP or like the flyengravity panels.

It seems the FDS CDU bay may be able to just slide under the Flyengravity MIP if all is to scale.


Important information. Will email Peter and talk to him about the CP Fit. Would love to see a picture of the bad fit if you have one handy.

I kind of think it wouldn't be too hard to get the FDS cdu pay to fit . I agree, it probably would slide under and it may not be a whole lot of pain to mate it with the Fly MIP. Hard to say though with out being there to size them up. If I had the bay I'd measure it all up for you, but dont have yet.

All the best,

[OmniAtlas]

Try this website -- Look Dad - No Mouse! - CP Flight PRO MCP & EFIS Installed - Journal - Flaps 2 Approach (http://www.flaps2approach.com/journal/2012/4/17/look-dad-no-mouse-cp-flight-pro-mcp-efis-installed.html)

[birdyguy]

Great website. Thanks. I've seen the FDS bracket that fits the JetMax. I think I could probably make it work. At this point I'm not sure if MIP backlighting for me would be a big issue. They do have lighting below the Glare and I think beneath the glare wing. Might be enough nto suit me. May have to take a drive down in the summer and have a look at one up close before I make my final decision.

[Alex0903]

Hello,

togehter with my CP Flight MCP pro and Efis I have ordered their "MIP bracket for MCP+Captain and F/O EFIS". Originally I used the bracket as holder for the MCP+Efis on my desk as it looks much nicer than their desk holder. ;)
However I started much earlier with expanding my homecockpit than intended. After long evenings of consideration "full MIP versus 2/3 MIP" I decided to go for the Jetmax solution.
As you may see on following pictures (I am sorry for the quality) it's quite easy to build in the MCP+Efis to the Jetmax. I just cut the bracket and mounted it (used some available holes in the Jetmax + some trench in the bracket which I sank a bit for the screws).
Just let me know if you have any further questions.

Btw: If you're looking for more impressions about the Jetmax there's a blog about it from an owner in Japan (google for Haru and Jetmax).

Kind regards,
Alex

7425

7426
7427

[birdyguy]

Hello Alex,

For some reason I can't access the attachments. Do you have a website url I can visit to view them? If not, can you send to my email : burtoned@gmail.com


I can relate to the long hours of consideration between full MIP and 2/3s. I am almost sure I will go with the 2/3 solution.



I am googling and looking at Haro's setup.



Thanks very much for your reply.

[Alex0903]

Hello Ed,

I just edited my first post. Can you see the pictures now?
If not I'll send them to your email.

Alex

[birdyguy]

Hello Ed,

I just edited my first post. Can you see the pictures now?
If not I'll send them to your email.

Alex



Hi Alex,

See them now. Thanks a lot.

[OmniAtlas]

Do you guys know if you can use the EFIS pro with the MCP el?

[birdyguy]

Do you guys know if you can use the EFIS pro with the MCP el?


Hello Omniatlas,

I can't say if one will work with the other, but I suspect they would. They all daisychain through a 5 pin din cable and are pretty much plug and play, but..like my CDU from FDS it will still cost you a few hours of setup time..nothing is really plug and play I think. This is really good gear and the support is phenomenal. I would email Claudio at CPFlight and ask. ( info<wbr style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px; line-height: 20px;">@cpflight.com ) He answered all my emails in a timely fashion before and after I bought my EL gear. The product is good, the shipping was amazingly fast and didn't break the bank. After market emails were all answered, had one little snag which got solved within a day. I wouldn't hesitate to do business with CPFlight again and will probably purchase all my radios from him in the future.

All the best

[Alex0903]

Hello Ed,

I have one question as I read on page 1 that you're using the PMDG 737NGX. Did you manage it to use the PMDG together with the FDS CDU? I tried many, many things in the meantime but it doesn't work here. :-( I just read your comment "like my CDU from FDS it will still cost you a few hours of setup time..nothing is really plug and play I think" and it seems so that you also had troubles with the CDU at first?

Thanks for your info.

Alex

[birdyguy]

Hello Ed,

I have one question as I read on page 1 that you're using the PMDG 737NGX. Did you manage it to use the PMDG together with the FDS CDU? I tried many, many things in the meantime but it doesn't work here. :-( I just read your comment "like my CDU from FDS it will still cost you a few hours of setup time..nothing is really plug and play I think" and it seems so that you also had troubles with the CDU at first?

Thanks for your info.

Alex


Hi Alex,


I am at the point now where the CDU starts up reliably with the PMDG 737NGX. While on the ground it has been working properly and works just like the one you see on the PMDG. There are a couple of issues I am having trouble with, and I think one is mostly FSX related. When I move into full screen mode, my screen flickers to black and the only way out is alt enter, which forces me to run in windowed mode. Not sure if this is a video card on the way out, too many monitors (4) or the cdu/cp flight gear combo.
Growing Pians I guess.


My last flight though, the Gatwick to Lowri run, the CDU display froze and I had to disconnect the autopilot. I dont know what caused this issue.

Installation takes awhile to digest but can be worked out after a couple hours. There is a line to be changed in the panel.cfg file that removes the buttons and frame from the cdu display and then is a matter of dragging over to the cdu window. There is also a cdu exe and a PMDG exe that needs to be run on startup with the PMDG. Both are at the FDS website.

Bottom Line: It is working with the PMDG 737NGX


All the best

[birdyguy]

Alex, I would be glad to go through what I did step by step if you would like to email me. Maybe it will work for you as well. send me your email address and I will make a list for you of the steps I took to get mine working. My email burtoned@gmail.com, or here even, whatever you prefer. Let me know.

[OmniAtlas]

Hi Ed, cpflight have responded and they have told me their pro and el series are interchangeable. Thanks.

Those with the el, any regrets not getting the mcp pro? The price is just not to my liking at double the cost.

[birdyguy]

Hi Ed, cpflight have responded and they have told me their pro and el series are interchangeable. Thanks.

Those with the el, any regrets not getting the mcp pro? The price is just not to my liking at double the cost.

Great support from CPFlight. Have nothing bad to say about them. I didn't want to spend the extra on the Pro model at this point either, Want to spend the exstra on a radio etc, then maybe upgrade to the Pro at a later date. Love mine. It pretty much does everything the Pro does al be it with some short cuts. Here are the differences as explained to me by Claudio:

Hello,

substantially the EL is an "entry-level" product where the PRO version is oriented to more exigent cockpit builder. The main differences of the PRO version are:

- Front-panel: the EL use a symple plastic plate backlighted by LED's placed on the main printed circuit board. The MCP-PRO have a more complex faceplate that include a special light diffusion layer and an additional printed circuit board with SMD LED's integrated in the faceplate thickness; this result in a more homogeneous and brilliant backlight.

- Pushbuttons: on the real 737 there are two main MCP versions (if I correctly remember one is produced by Honeywell and the other by Collins). The two versions use different pushbuttons. One use dual dot green LED and the labels are on the frontplate (EL) the other have labels directly on the pushbuttons (PRO). This involve an higher cost.

- A/T ARM switch: the PRO version use electromagnetic disengage Auto Throttle ARM switch (automatically disengage at the tuchdown during autoland and so on). Due to the low cost concept of the EL, this is not used in this version, the Auto Throttle disarm condition is indicated by the A/T Led blinking, but the switch remain in the ON position.

- Knobs: the PRO version use custom made knobs for the rotaries (where the EL version have standard knobs with different shape respect the real one)

- Bank selector: the PRO version use dual concentric knob on the HDG to allows to directly select the bank angle limit. The function is also supported by the EL version, but there is not a dedicated knob. To set the bank angle on the EL version you have to push and hold the HDG pusbutton for more than 2 seconds to enter the Bank angle setting mode and then set the angle throug the HDG knob. It work, but it is not like the real 737.

- white display on the PRO version where the EL use amber display (this is relted to the equivalent real version).

- the PRO also use a more strong construction and better components.

About the EFIS consider the same concept; for example the RADIO/BARO and IN/HPA selector on the PRO version have a dedicated concentric knob where the EL version support this function on the single knob throug "push-Hold and rotate".
The PRO version MCP will be available again in the next few days.

Best Regards,
Claudio Azimonti
CPflight


All the best,

[OmniAtlas]

Hi Thanks Ed, I'm going to go ahead with the MCP EL purchase but I'm not very happy with the paypal conversion rate with the credit card. Did you buy direct from CP Flight or another retailer?

Cheers,

Ben

[birdyguy]

Hi Thanks Ed, I'm going to go ahead with the MCP EL purchase but I'm not very happy with the paypal conversion rate with the credit card. Did you buy direct from CP Flight or another retailer?

Cheers,

Ben

Hi Ben,

I bought direct from CP Flight. Had it in 6 days. Euro is sitting around 1.30 something right now, hurts a bit. I see an EL set for sale in the classifieds, but the guy isn't answering any of his mail..so might be a red flag there.

I'm really enjoying my gear.

All the best

[OmniAtlas]

Yeah, we may wait for the currency to steady before making the final decision. Or until a better deal comes up - second hand anyone?

Do you know how many radio panels I can plug into the MCP before I need a power adapter?

Thanks again.

[birdyguy]

Yeah, we may wait for the currency to steady before making the final decision. Or until a better deal comes up - second hand anyone?

Do you know how many radio panels I can plug into the MCP before I need a power adapter?

Thanks again.

Hi Ben,

The Euro has been sitting at 1.30 Canadian for a long long time now. Might be awhile before that changes. There's a nice combo for sale in the classifieds, but it seems he's not getting his emails for some reason. I think 800 is a very good price and they are unused..still in the plastic wrap. Mine cost me $1000 plus after exchange..shipping and taxes.

I've emailed Claudio about a function on my EFIS and at the same time asked him how many modules can be daisy chained before a power supply becomes necessary. Will let you know his answer when I hear back from him.

All the best,m

[OmniAtlas]

Thanks Ed.

Found an FDS older model MCP and EFIS for sale as well. Can anyone vouch for its functionality? I think it is based on their older G2 interface card which was also created by cp flight. CP flight is plug and play; I don't know anything about the FDS model - documentation/reviews on the web is severely lacking.

[birdyguy]

Yeah, we may wait for the currency to steady before making the final decision. Or until a better deal comes up - second hand anyone?

Do you know how many radio panels I can plug into the MCP before I need a power adapter?

Thanks again.

This was the response from CPFlight concerning the power adapter:

If you want to add other to the modules that you arleady have is better to add the power supply ( usually the configuration without power supply is the MCP with 2 efis). The efis have no display so thay have a low power consumption, instead the radio, due to the display, have an high power consumption and need the power supply
Regards,
Paolo
CPflight

All the best,

[OmniAtlas]

Thanks Ed, that clarifies it. I have a second hand 737NAV radio on the way, and hopefully the MCP EL and EFIS EL -- I hope I don't regret the EFIS EL -- wanted to go with the PRO, maybe at the later stage.

I've switched over the NGX to use the honeywell so I can get use to it :) No real difference there.

The only real difference I can see between the PRO and the EL is the cosmetic and solenoid switch -- perhaps the build quality is better, but we will have to see.

I'm still waiting for my Jetmax throttle from FDS. :-/

[birdyguy]

Thanks Ed, that clarifies it. I have a second hand 737NAV radio on the way, and hopefully the MCP EL and EFIS EL -- I hope I don't regret the EFIS EL -- wanted to go with the PRO, maybe at the later stage.

I've switched over the NGX to use the honeywell so I can get use to it :) No real difference there.

The only real difference I can see between the PRO and the EL is the cosmetic and solenoid switch -- perhaps the build quality is better, but we will have to see.

I'm still waiting for my Jetmax throttle from FDS. :-/

I was in the same boat. Would have liked the Pro as well, but on the same line of thought can upgrade later if the need is there. The cost is high to ride the cutting edge. Nice to have gear coming in, the waiting is tough but is also fun to know that flight gear is on the way. I enjoy my EL series so far and to date only have one outstanding function issue and am waiting a reply from cp flight.

Kind of a shame that Prosim is doubling up on the price. I'm not ready for it myself yet. I downloaded it but have yet to really get it working proper to do a good demo..so I think my time will run out before I actually get the demo functioning to the point where I would feel comfortable to make a purchase. I know the word is, "If you think you may need it..buy it now" but $400 is a lot of cash to have tied up for something not used. Just random thoughts. Hope you get your gear soon. It really adds to the illusion of flight.

All the best

[OmniAtlas]

Saw your mounts for your EFIS on your web Ed, is that all custom built?

how is your build coming along?

[mounty]

The EL series of the MCP & EFIS is only 699 Euro's not 999. The MCP is 499 and the EFIS is 199.

Rob

[birdyguy]

The EL series of the MCP & EFIS is only 699 Euro's not 999. The MCP is 499 and the EFIS is 199.

Rob

Hello Rob,

Indeed you are correct as to the prices in Euros.

However, as I stated in a previous post converted to funds CAD then todays amount would be $909.00 CAD . The Euro is trading at 1.28 this morning and when I was doing my research the Euro was at $1.34 CAD. The shipping costs were another $128.00 CAD. I can assure you, that my receipt for the two devices was around the $1000.00 CAD by the time it arrived at my door.

[birdyguy]

Saw your mounts for your EFIS on your web Ed, is that all custom built?

how is your build coming along?

Hi Ben,

On vacation at the moment so tricky to find a internet connection. The mounts are just temporary until I construct an MIP. For the EFIS I used angle brackets from hardware store (x4). The MCP are just several pieces of wood cut at 45 degrees All temporary until I can fit them into an MIP but useful now at the desk.

will add more info when I get back home