TH2GO or Software...that is the question

[Infinity]

The short question is how is 225 FOV achieved on FSX? Is it TH2GO, Warping Software, or a combination of both? Will TH2GO give you a 225, or 180 by itself or is 135 the standard? For those who are warping two separate windows into one display on a single projector, does these impact your performance at all? Thanks.

[OmniAtlas]

I think Immersive Display can do automatic edge blending and warping with multiple windows.

[Infinity]

So if i opted to use TH2GO and warping software due to a cuved screen and three projectors capable of 75 degrees, will i still be able to get 225 fov? Incorporating TH2GO should prevent performance issues. I appreciate the quick responses.

[Infinity]

Thank you Nick.

[ammarmalhas]

Nick,
Though this thread has been inactive for well over a year now I am hoping you somehow receive notice of updates here.
Anyway, if you do receive this I would appreciate your help setting up my 225 Deg screen with 3 projectors.
Currently I have 3 BenQ projectors, a 225 Deg cylindrical screen at 225cm radius and 2m height. I am running FSX on one computer with my three projectors combined in one using AMD's Eyefinity (sort of like TH2G). I am also using Immersive Calibration Pro and Immersive Display Pro to warp the images projected into the proper 225 Deg projection on the scree. Immersive Calibration pro produces the required settings of the views (cameras) needed to produce the 225 Deg curved view and that is a great feature.
I am OK with the image I am getting (3 x 1280x800), which is not so impressive at 2.25m away (you can actually see the pixels (5mmx5mm each), BUT my problem is the FPS i am getting in FSX and P3D, a mere 12 fps which is truly unacceptable.
My computer setup is very powerful but I think running three views in FSX is just too much for the game regardless of the power of your CPU, memory, and graphics card!
I would like to try to run three computers each running FSX with Wideview, each producing one view on one projector and I need to know how t do that and how to warp the projected images to produce one continuous warped view.
Do you know of any software that can warp three projectors each running on a separate computer?
I appreciate any guidance.
Thank you.
Ammar

[ammarmalhas]

Nick,
Sorry I did not see your post till now!
Thank you for posting a response. I am also using 3 views and no 4th view (do we need that?). But I am getting 13-14 fps only on the ground at London City. I will try some other airport in a less dense area and see what I get.
A real shame that FSX/P3D cannot be run at full display options on a 3 view setup!
These games were not designed for large view surfaces!
When you start the 3-computer/WideView setup, please record what you do and share with us so many can enjoy your findings.
thanks again.
Ammar

[Firefly77]

Hi guys,

I am running a 200 degrees curved screen with 3 optoma full hd projectors 1920x1080 including Immersive Calibration and Immersive Display Pro and I am very happy with it. My Projectors are connected to 1 PC via Nvidia Surround and I am running P3D 2.5. Also with demanding sceneries like Aerosoft Frankfurt X together with Orbx Ftx Global and pretty high settings I achieve arround 25 fps which is absolutely ok ! With Flytampa Kaitak i get more than 30 fps as well with high settings like cloud shadows ,water reflections etc.

here you can see a little example:

http://youtu.be/uOyTCF1e6ps

My PC is an i7 4770K Overclocked to 4.3 GHz, 8gb Ram, win7 Ultimate and Flightsimstuff installed on a SSD, so not really a killer machine :)

If I can some hints please do not hesitate to ask :)

Cheers

Michael

[OmniAtlas]

Hi guys,

here you can see a little example:

http://youtu.be/uOyTCF1e6ps

My PC is an i7 4770K Overclocked to 4.3 GHz, 8gb Ram, win7 Ultimate and Flightsimstuff installed on a SSD, so not really a killer machine :)

If I can some hints please do not hesitate to ask :)

Cheers

Michael

Hi Michael, looks great! I see you are using Ikea products to help setup your screen :) How many poles did you use, and how did you attach the curve screen to the pole?

Thank you.

[Firefly77]

Hi OmniAtlas,


It is great that somebody from australia recognize that somebody from Germany is using swedish products, isn't it :) little world :)

I used 6 poles, 3 on each side. In the middle the screen, which is just a 3mm wood plate (in Germany the material is called MDF), is attached on the wall.

I used 2 ikea stolmen end fittings on each pole and mount a wood lath in between. To this wood lath 3x4cm I attached the screen.

The screen is painted right now with ordinary white wall paint but I will experiment with a gray like paint which is called "black widow". This paint should give a gain factor of 0.7 and this should nearly eliminate the brighter overlapping areas of the projectors. But I am already very happy with my results.

Just for info, the screen is 1,6m high starting at 55cm from the floor and the total length is 6,11m.


Cheers


Michael

[ammarmalhas]

@Michael,

I have the exact same setup you have with 3 BenQ projectors now (i am getting 3 Optoma GT1080's) and I also use Immersive Pro software. My rig is an ASUS Z87k with an i7 at 4790 at 4GHz, 16Gb at 2667Hz and a Radeon R9 295 x2 and I am using AMD Eyefinity instead of the Nvidia Surround.
I have been trying P3D 2.2, 2.4 and FSX but the best I could get out of all software was closer to 13fps (at medium scenery settings).
It seems running three views kills the fps!
Are you using the three views as exported from Immersive Calibration Pro?
Can you please share your FSX or P3D settings with us? And can you please pm me a copy of your flight file, I would like to see what your views are defined as.
Have you done any "tweaking" to get the 25fps?
And finally, can you report what kind of fps you get while you are on the tarmac at London City with medium settings of everything and in a Cessna?

From your cool video I notice you also have the "too bright" joint between the three projectors. I also could not get better blending from Immersive and almost no way to do it manually!
Though the scenery and clarity are fabulous (I love the Frankfurt Dusk footage), i am not sure why there is too much "stuttering" (not sure the words explains what I mean!)? Looks like the picture is being stepped through, not too smooth! Or is this the video, YouTube and my MACBookPro? Looking at again i am almost sure it is Youtube and my computer :-(

Thank you in advance and I am very interested to see how you were able to achieve twice what I have!
Verrrrry interesting :-)

Ammar

[ammarmalhas]

I confirm the stuttering was from my end; playing the video on Youtube over the internet! I downloaded it and played it on my computer, it is just fantastic, i wish i can achieve this!

[OmniAtlas]

Hi OmniAtlas,


It is great that somebody from australia recognize that somebody from Germany is using swedish products, isn't it :) little world :)

I used 6 poles, 3 on each side. In the middle the screen, which is just a 3mm wood plate (in Germany the material is called MDF), is attached on the wall.

I used 2 ikea stolmen end fittings on each pole and mount a wood lath in between. To this wood lath 3x4cm I attached the screen.


Cheers


Michael

Thanks Michael, I only have 1 projector so I may consider doing half a screen or 90 degrees first to experiment.

[Firefly77]

Hi Ammar,

sorry for my late reply. Unfortuneatly I haven´t had the time to do some pictures or screenshots.

First of all I have to say that I am using the projectAirbus A320 out of the fantastic Jeehell FMGS in preparation for my coming A320 homecockpit.
Maybe already this brings some FPS.
I am using the exported camera definitions out of Immersive Calibration Pro, so I do also have 3 (which are really 4) windows (views). I have done no tweaking which I think is not necessary in P3D 2.5.
Pictures of my P3D settings will follow maybe at the weekend. I do not use hard water and shadow settings (water low with cloud refle. / just cloud shadows on ground) but all my other settings are pretty right.
Yesterday evening I quick tested London City area, of course with PJAirbus A320, and got with very high autogen settings around 23-25 fps.
I expected more cause with other standard sceneries I achieved always more than 35-40 FPS but i guess that that london city is frame consuming beacuse of the autogen, buildings, water etc.

Do you have the K version of the 4790 ? If yes push it a bit more, I think 4,5GHz should be working :-)

Best regards

Michael

[ammarmalhas]

Thank you Michael.
I am really astonished as to why I am getting such low fps when my settings are almost the same as yours!
The only real differences I see are that I am using P3D v2.4 not 2.5 and my projectors are BenQ 1280x800 not Optoma 1920x1080!
Could it be the projectors are somehow affecting the fps (I seriously doubt it!)?
I will download P3D v2.5 (I did not know it was out already) and I will try it and see what I can get out of it!
The last thing I can do is probably overclock the i7 and maybe change the motherboard as I have already changed the i7 (from 4770 to 4790), changed the RAM from 1666 to 2667 and changed the graphics card from Radeon R9 290 to 295 x2! The only thing left is the ASUS Z87k MOBO!
I am sure I am not making sense but I probably will try another motherboard and see if that makes a difference!
I will be waiting for your P3D settings and I will try to imitate them and see what I can get.
I am now very baffled and annoyed at my tough luck with FSX and P3D!
Bless you,
Ammar

[Firefly77]

Hey Ammar,

no, the projectors can not be a reason in terms of measured fps. They can be a reason for the feel of smoothness if you have an issue regarding refresh rate but not with the measured fps from fsx or p3d.

I am not sure if amd graphic cards still have issues with fsx or p3d. In the past people told about microstutters with radeon cards, but this shouldnt be the reason for low fps as well.

Did you update your bios when you changed your cpu ? I have the asus z87 pro motherboard and i know that there was a necessary update for the devils canyon cpu 4790 ! Bios version must be at least "2005".

Regards

Michael

[ammarmalhas]

Thank you Michael.

I knew what you are confirming about the projectors but i am left with no other logical reason for the low fps!

When I had my i7 upgraded the technician did perform a BIOS update, so I assume I have 2005. i will check tomorrow.

Again, i will wait for your settings and see what is going on. Could you also send me a "flt" file with your views settings, i am sure Immersive's views are fine because they do produce a good 225 screen. If you do not mind sending me the P3D "cfg" file as well, i will run a comparison and see what is the difference.

I am wondering if anyone has an explanation to why two people with identical (almost) setups are getting different result to the tone of %100!

Thanks.
Ammar

[Firefly77]

Hi Ammar,

here you find the .cfg and the fxml file:

https://docs.google.com/folderview?id=0B-g3_WbOCipcN0ZJT1Q2S2UzSkU&usp=docslist_api

and here I made a quick video of the london city test incl. my settings:

http://youtu.be/LFDU-F_v-4s

hope this helps !

best regards

Michael

[ammarmalhas]

Dear FireFly77,

I failed to write you earlier but I was , and still am, too busy setting up a B737 sim, and now I am trying to calibrate and run a 3-projector setup with 3 PCs running FSX on each with WidevieW to get one view per PC, that is supposed to give me the fastest fps at much higher graphics settings! I also got me 3 Optoma 1920x1080 :smile: the quality of the display is way better than the BenQ 1280x800, waaaay better!

I still envy you the results you are getting and I will not rest until I get what you have shown me in your video.

It will take me time to finish the hardware setup and to calibrate the screens, but eventually i will get to the settings in P3D or FSX and I will report back here.

Many thanks for all your kind help.

[ammarmalhas]

Dear Chinxxx,
Yes it can, that is what the software is all about :smile:
Ammar

[wody]

Hi guys, I am running a 200 degrees curved screen with 3 optoma full hd projectors 1920x1080 including Immersive Calibration and Immersive Display Pro and I am very happy with it. My Projectors are connected to 1 PC via Nvidia Surround and I am running P3D 2.5. .... Michael Hello Michael, just saw your setup. It is nearly the same I am planning for my Cessna Mustang cockpit+ shell. My layout is only 3,4m and with 210° FOV with 3 GT1070X. I calculated based on the Projector Design Tutorial (Flitedeck Solutions) with screen overlap of 12%. The results are ok and match basically your numbers. The GT1070x (also 1080) has a 16:9 ratio, which gives a height of appr. 120cm at 214 cm width. Your screen is 1,6m high. In the video it looks quite high. Question: What is the height of the picture? Because of the 16:9 ratio I considered already 4:3 projectors. Unfortunately there are only XGA and WXGA with less resolution and throw ratio <0,5 available. Is the resolution of 1080 so much better than the 800? I would prefer a higher picture, because looking to the left side you will have more vertical FOV. What do you think about? Peter edit: linebreaks inserted..

[wody]

don't know, why linebreaks are not showing up. SORRY Peter

[Firefly77]

Hi Wody,

my projectors have a distance to the screen of approx. 1,8m and they are mounted at 2,5m height. The picture height as shown in my video is 1,46m which will be great for an a320 cockpit. Your citation cockpit will be much smaller so you are able to move your projs a bit more away (regarding shadows of the shell) to gain a larger picture.

I think you should be fine with your setup and get same tesults ad i do.

best regards

Michael

[wody]

Hi Michael, thanks for the info. My concern is the view to the left side, since the Mustang windows are really big (on the side). But I can live with seeing a little bit of the floor looking to the left. Front view is no problem. By the way, when I was calculating and comparing the figures for different projectors I made a small Ecxel sheet to play around with different measuremants. I will post the sheet later here in this thread. Peter

The excel sheet is on Dropbox:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xpzl38oes7psx4u/Projector%20setup.xlsx?dl=0

Peter

NN: LF seems to work now, but the error msg is still there...
Peter

[wody]

"Warning: Only variables should be passed by reference in ..../newreply.php on line 389". This is the message I get when I post. Same in Quick reply and also in Advanced. When I type the post all is formatted as I want it. All LF are shown but not in the thread. ANY HELP? What I'm doing wrong?

Firefox V41.0.2

Peter

[ammarmalhas]

∑역삼오피≪Opyo01.CoM≫ 【오피요】 ょ오산오피√서면건마↘오산오피 ∑역삼오피≪Opyo01.CoM≫ 【오피요】 ょ오산오피√서면건마↘오산오피 ∑역삼오피≪Opyo01.CoM≫ 【오피요】 ょ오산오피√서면건마↘오산오피 ∑역삼오피≪Opyo01.CoM≫ 【오피요】 ょ오산오피√서면건마↘오산오피 ∑역삼오피≪Opyo01.CoM≫ 【오피요】 ょ오산오피√서면건마↘오산오피

Are we supposed to understand this??? English please!

[xplanematt]

It's Klingon. They are trying to build a Bird of Prey sim, but the Romulans won't share cockpit photos.

Matt

[ammarmalhas]

Hahahahahaha :D
A very good one :lol:

[ammarmalhas]

Hahahahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol:
A very good one :D

[ngidalov]

Hi All,


This is the ultimate tool for perfect geometrical correction with multi monitor setups:
Fly Elise-ng LCD Designer!!!!!


http://fly.elise-ng.net/index.php/news/77-news-immersivedisplaypro10r1
http://fly.elise-ng.net/images/Documents/Lcd/LCDDesignerPROStepByStepGuide.pdf


From the web site:
////////////////////////////////////////
For those who use multiple LCD displays in their simulation setups and for those who really do care about correct geometrical views......
There are thousand of posts and questions on internet:
"How to correct and fish the 'fisheye' effect in my game when I use multiple monitors and wide angle of view?"
Well, the answer is simple: For 100% correct geometry that matches the position and the orientation of the LCD displays a separate view needs to be generated per LCD. This is it !!! There is no other way to properly correct the 'fisheye' effect caused by the mathematics of the perspective projection used by computer graphics.
Fly Elise-ng introduces LCD Panel Designer. Just create your LCD panels setup and the software will produce the needed view information and the needed geometric correction for perfect geometrical views with no distortion even when using field of views larger than 180 deg or even true 360 degrees.
Load the views info in your simulator (FSX, P3D, X-Plane , Unity, DCS or any other software that supports multi-view) and load the exported geometrical correction in Immersive Display PRO. That's all.
This is a short list of available features:
- Define the dimensions of the LCD panels (the image area)
- Define the bezel sizes per LCD
- Define the LCD panels positions and orientation
- Automatically calculate view (frustum) info per LCD
- Automatically calculate geometric correction
- Automatically compensate for LCD panel bezels
- View(frustum) export for all all popular simulators and game engines
- Export for Immersive Display PRO
////////////////////////////////////


Regards,
Nikola